Episode #176 Calm Your Nervous System

Transcript
an Interview with Maureen Kafkis
The Brain BS Coach
October 2, 2023

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You are listening to My Freedom Grove podcast with Gretchen Hernandez, episode 176.

Welcome to My Freedom Grove Podcast, your calm space for practical help to get your dream business up and running while being authentically you and taking care of your mental health. I'm your host, Gretchen Hernandez. I'm so glad you're here!

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Hi My Strong Friends. 

 

Hey, why did you go into business?

 

Was it because you really wanted to? You always wanted to be an entrepreneur? 

 

Or was it that you were working in the corporate environment, and it just wasn't a good fit anymore? Either, it didn't fit with the lifestyle goals that you had. Maybe there were some challenges that popped up in your life? Maybe it was yourself or some family members? Or maybe you got enticed by a lot of people talking about different types of businesses and how much money you could make in it? 

 

One thing that people don't really talk about is that when you jump into entrepreneurship, it can create a lot of havoc with your nervous system. So I know that I talk a lot about mindset, obstacles and process obstacles. 

 

NERVOUS SYSTEM DYSREGULATION AS AN OBSTACLE

 

But sometimes your nervous system itself is creating some of those obstacles. 

 

And yes, a bunch of it can happen from our mindset, and it starts to manifest in your body. But sometimes it's really hard to pinpoint exactly what it is that's causing it. 

 

If you have ever had any nervous system dysregulation, you know how very very uncomfortable and sometimes downright painful it can be. 

 

So I wanted to introduce you to a very dear friend of mine, Maureen Kafkis. She has created a course for the struggling coach, that is having a lot of those nervous system issues. It's really hard to focus on business and to make progress when your nervous system is just all out of whack. 

 

It's important for you to learn a lot of the skills and the techniques for how to calm down your nervous system. And then you can get back to work. 

 

So it is my pleasure to introduce to you Maureen Kafkis. 

 

Hi, Maureen. It is so great to have you today. How are you?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

I'm good. I'm really happy to be here. And I'm hoping that it doesn't matter that I didn't look at the questions in advance. Like I'm ready for it. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah, you are a fantastic communicator and able to have great conversations. So yeah, I I know that this is going to be entertaining and highly valuable and educational to everybody that's listening. 

 

So this is going to be great. 

 

Maureen, please introduce yourself.

 

MEET MAUREEN KAFKIS

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Okay, so I am Maureen Kafkis. I'm The Brain BS Coach.

 

Maureen Kafkis 

I help people to master their Brain BS, which is their unconscious and subconscious programming, so that they can be successful and have a nervous system to support it. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

And they get to define what success means to them. And they learn to trust themselves to not listen to anybody else and do things their way.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

So good. I love the freedom to always get to do stuff our own way and be authentic to what works for us. I love that you're doing this. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Tell me about the regulating of the nervous system, because there are some people that this may be the first time that they've heard that, of regulating their nervous system. 

 

DO YOU FEEL PANICKY, ANXIOUS, OR SCARED OF WHAT OTHERS THINK?

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

What are the symptoms they're experiencing where they know that, oh, that's my nervous system, and I need to regulate it? 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

People don't realize that when they're experiencing a strong feeling that's uncomfortable, that's their nervous system. Right? All it is, is their emotions in their body being activated, typically, because it's something in the past. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

And they don't realize, like when it's happening, that it's a nervous system dysregulation. They just think I'm panicky or I'm anxious or I'm so scared of what that person is going to think of my post and oh my god, I think I did something wrong. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

That's all nervous system dysregulation. We just don't typically look at it that way. Because we look at it as related to our thoughts and the actions we're taking and doing wrong things. And that's where I think everybody gets mixed up, myself included at first. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

I do believe in the value of thought work, but it goes so much deeper than that. And now that I really started focusing on the nervous system, and mind-body connection, that's where I found what I was looking for, what worked for me.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Ahh, so good.

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

I remember back when I was still an employee in corporate, and I had this really great boss, he was my boss for 10 years. But every time he'd come and say, Hey, Gretchen, can you come to my office, I want to talk to you about something, my whole body would clench up. I'd be in almost physical pain, and freaking out about it. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

I never knew what it was that he wanted to talk about, but my body assumed it was going to be something really bad and awful. And I immediately went to like, you know, thinking, what are all the things that it could be. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

And then every time I'd go in and talk with them, it was always something really great. It was never anything that was bad. And I was trying to figure out, why am I always acting this way, and especially after ten years, and it was never anything bad. Like it, he was giving me lots of evidence that it was safe to go in. But my body was just not cooperating.

 

WHAT ARE THE TRIGGERS?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yeah, that's what I'm talking about. So, so many of us are walking around with unacknowledged trauma in our body, right? That you know, from your past, a lot of trauma that you experienced, and you acknowledge it. But you still have unacknowledged trauma in there, too. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

So when something happens, and you can't figure out why, and you think you did all the work on it, it's because your body's over there saying we have a little bit more work to do. You're overlooking something that happened to you, minimizing some sort of trauma that you had, because we, especially women, minimize everything that we've been through.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

I grew up in a family of 10 kids, an Irish Catholic family, there was a lot, a lot of digging around a lot of people, we had a lot of fun. So by any means was it a bad situation, it was, we had food on the table, everything that we could use, and we laughed a lot. And I sustained major emotional trauma on a daily basis. Because I was sensitive, I was misunderstood. And I didn't get the support I needed. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

So I didn't feel emotionally safe. And I've been minimizing that my entire life, I acknowledged it, I did the thought-work on it. I went deeper with doing other things. I tried all kinds of different modalities. And I continued to do that, because it goes that deep. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

I've been doing a deep dive for three years, just to give you an idea. Deep, deep, deep way back to the beginning, for us to be walking around thinking that when we get certified, that we're good to go we did all the work on ourselves is just like completely not true.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah. And just to clarify, when you say certified, that means certified as a life coach. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yes, yes. 

 

IT TURNS OUT A DYSREGULATED NERVOUS SYSTEM IS QUITE COMMON

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

And I have lots of different entrepreneurs that listen to this podcast. So some are coaches and they have gone through coach certification. And some are entrepreneurs in other aspects. But I'm finding that nervous system dysregulation is really quite common, and it can definitely make it a lot harder to be an entrepreneur. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

You had mentioned about social media posts, and that one I see a lot, because I'll work with entrepreneurs that are introverts. And they would prefer to be at home and do social media, as opposed to go out and talk with people at large events. Then they go to do the social media. But then the post, that's stopping them because their body is having that response. And so is that something that you ever experienced? 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Oh, god, yes. So before I even got certified as a life coach, I left Facebook because it was freaking me out. And the other thing it was doing, I was trying to take care of everybody on there.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Tell me what that means. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

That's people pleasing. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Okay.

 

Maureen Kafkis 

Taking care of other people, I would go into the Facebook feeds, and I would see people suffering. And I would be trying to help all of them. While my family, sitting in the room with me, like, What are you doing? Why are you on your social media so much? 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

And it became a problem for me, because I felt the need, if somebody else wasn't giving someone encouragement, I felt like I had to do it. Because I used to take responsibility for everyone's emotional well-being, being number nine not a ten. That was like where I fit. And the reason for that is because it made me more comfortable. Right?  

 

Maureen Kafkis 

It was uncomfortable to see other people being uncomfortable for me. So I left it. I just left it for a few years and I decided not to do it. Then I came back to it when I decided to be an entrepreneur. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

And this is kind of funny because I remember the guy, a local guy who was trying to help me. I was having trauma responses and didn't even know it because I had no insight whatsoever. And this guy was looking at me like I was nuts. I'm like, I just need clarity on Facebook. I just need clarity. He’s like It’s pretty clear, you need clarity, Maureen. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

It was a trauma response. I completely overreacted. And yet you become super sensitive to anything that’s on there. You internalize all of it. You personalize it. You think things are happening to you that aren't. It's a complete delusion. It's like, talk about Brain BS. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Uh huh. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

There might not be any other place where you experienced more brain vias than trying to be an entrepreneur online.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah, I definitely have found that it brings up every insecurity that I ever had. And if I actually want to be a successful entrepreneur, I have to work through those insecurities. But also, the trauma response, you are a hundred percent spot on with that. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

For me, for the first couple of years after I left corporate, LinkedIn could create a trauma response for me, Facebook was fine. But LinkedIn‚Äď‚Äď trauma response,

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Oh, that's so funny, because I was just listening to someone who was the opposite. And they, they felt comfortable on LinkedIn, because it was legitimate, it was professional, it was business. But Facebook is more, it's kind of like high school, right? 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Sometimes, like when you get any of these clicky little groups and stuff and like you don't belong there, or you don't fit in. I mean, it's just, it's just all. It's made up stuff in your head, and thoughts that you’re having. And it's unacknowledged trauma in your body that's being activated. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Once you realize both those things are happening, which is what I did, then I was able to move past it. Because in order to be successful, I haven't achieved my goals yet, but you have to go big. And in order to go big, you have to be big. And that means you have to put yourself out there in major ways, and not care how anybody else is responding to it. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

You are just so lit up with what you're doing, and you believe in it so much, which is why you have to do things your way. You can't take someone else's advice and do what they tell you to do based on what they think you should do. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Because for me, it did not work that way. I'm sure it could for some people, but with no business background or ever doing anything like this before. I mean, I don't mark it or do anything the way anybody else does. And I'm having so much more fun now.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

I want to know, what was your journey like of becoming a coach and entrepreneur? Because this is just like me, later in life where we decided, Okay, we're gonna go and be an entrepreneur. But we had a whole long thing that we did ahead of time. And so I'm curious about that journey and how you're able to bring some of that forward into your business.

 

SUCCESS CAN HAPPEN AT ANY AGE, ANY STAGE

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Okay, well, I've always been a late bloomer. I didn't get married till forty, graduated from college until thirty-two. I got my master's in my forties. And I got my doctorate in occupational therapy, I went to school at fifty-three. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So I've always done things a little bit later, I never really think too much about the age thing. I did it first when I came into all this, but I also was an occupational therapist for twenty-five  years. And I've heard people phrase it, that we who are therapists are the original life coach. We look at habits, patterns and routines. And we look at the whole picture of how somebody's functioning, and their daily life, their cognition, their vision, all of it. So that kind of I was always kind of coaching people. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then after I got my doctorate, I was going to become an Elder Care Consultant. And in my program, they helped me to create my website and everything. So the program is great, because it helped me get set up for all that. And then right after I did that and graduated,  COVID hit. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Oh, no. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Yeah, but I was already kind of freaked out. Just like because of the whole sales and marketing thing. I can create the website and do all this stuff. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Make it look nice. But I was just like, really scared. And then I was like, really choosing to go for it. And then COVID hit, so then our pool contractor, believe it or not nobody told me about Brooke Castillo, and the Life Coach School. I looked it up, and I saw scholars. So I looked her up, I joined scholars that day. And then three days later I talked to my husband and said I have to go for the certification. I know we just paid for school. But I just know I have to do this and I promise at some point, I'm gonna make the money back. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So I ended up signing up for that. And COVID ended up being literally one of the best years of my life. Because I was in my home, I couldn’t  compare and despair. I didn't have any fear of missing out all the things that were always plaguing me, were taken out of the mix. And I could just dive into learning all about myself. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

It was amazing. It was freeing. It was a relief. I know, it was really challenging for a lot of people. And it was for me at times. But I loved it. And then I started doing it. And then I started coaching. And I was going to be a stepmom, coach. And then I was going to be a midlife coach, because you know, talking about age related changes, just trying to I was testing the waters. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And you know, What's your niche? question that plagues so many people. I didn't know what I was doing. I was just doing what everybody told me to do. So I started my podcast, I got my website, I got my cards, I did all this stuff. I actually started to get clients before I did all that when I was doing it my way. I got paid twenty-seven thousand dollars in a few months, just out the gates.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

How was it that you were doing it your way? What did that look like back then?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

At The Life Coach School, they have two tracks after you, they used to do two tracks after you graduated. So I did entrepreneur track, but I wasn't doing anything on it because I was too busy getting clients. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

That's not a bad thing 

 

Maureen Kafkis

I know, that what my group would tell me that, because I would be panicking that I wasn't doing that stuff. And they're like, you don't have to. So when doing it my way, and genuinely from my heart. It was going great. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah. So how were you meeting your clients? And having them become paying clients?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Well, okay, so my dentist became people that I knew from growing up people that I saw and my class reunion, it was mostly people that I saw in person that I've talked to.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

So people that you already knew.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yeah, and some people online because I did free coaching. Because that's what it was suggested, like, do free coaching. So I met these people. And then I created this community, The Brain BS Community. I decided to do it for a year. I charged three hundred for the year, and I had like 10 people sign up. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

Oh, great. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So yeah, just from talking to people online, inserting coaching and different groups, that was kind of different than anyone else, and people appreciated it. So then they would DM me and they would come look at what I was doing. But as soon as I started to make money, I got excited. And then I got scared.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Ah, tell me about the scard part of it.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

I remember being in Santa Barbara at the island and looking at my husband and saying, Oh my god, I think I'm, I think I'm actually doing this. I'm gonna actually get clients and make money. He's like, awesome. And I was just like‚Äď‚ÄďI had a trauma response. It was like, okay, it was fear. Like I had this response, like, But how am I going to keep doing this? Like, How is this? How can it be sustainable?¬†

 

Maureen Kafkis

The one-on-one and the amount of time I was doing with all of it? You know, I was just like, I don't know. So then. Then I got panicky, it slowed down. A couple clients, like one complained, because I charged her for no show. Another one thought I was being greedy. Because I hired a business coach, and they told me to charge more money, shorten the sessions and see them less often. And I listened to them. Even though it didn't feel good. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

But I didn't have any idea that the answers were inside me for any of it not. I thought, I've never been in business before. I've never been a coach like this before. I had no idea how to do this. It literally, my brain was all inside me. At that time. It was impossible. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So yeah, so I hired a couple of business coaches. I didn't make any money. I spent a lot of money on the business coaches. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And the last one, I got pissed. I got pissed off because she did a podcast episode and referred to me in the podcast episode talking to a new member of her staff. And they were answering questions right that we turned in. And I had tongue in cheek questions because I was just being nice and fun and inviting them in. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And the person who came in was making an assessment of my questions. And based on my questions, he said I was crying out in pain for help. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

No.

 

Maureen Kafkis

I was not doing anything. His literal words were, She's absolutely not doing anything. And this particular coach knows, I was a primo student, showed up and I was ready to go. And I did all the work. And for her to sit there and listen to that on her podcast episode was the best thing ever because I was so mad. I tried to bypass it spiritually because I was like, and I didn't even know I was doing that. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

I'm like, well, I should if I'm going to be spiritual, and I'm going to live consciously, I shouldn't be getting upset about this. I should be able to handle anything like this when it happens. And then I was like, Oh, screw that. I'm pissed. So I put a big post in our group, and I left the group. Then I posted on social media that I was hiring a new CEO for my business, and her name is Maureen Kafkis.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

I love it. I love it. Yes, because you already had a way that was working for you. You just had that obstacle that popped up of what if I get overwhelmed by the amount of casework afterwards. And that is a really common obstacle that pops up. I've felt it. I've had other clients that have felt it. And it's just a matter of solving for that obstacle, but not scrapping all the rest of the stuff because it was working for you. It was your magic special sauce.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

I know. But you know what? My brain couldn't see that at the time. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

Yeah.

 

Maureen Kafkis

My brain thought everything had gone terribly wrong. And I didn't have any idea of what I was doing. I remember hearing people talk about having that double digit month. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

Yeah.

 

Maureen Kafkis

And how bad they wanted it. And they're all striving for it. And I was thinking, What would that be like? What would that be like? And then when I finally paid attention to metrics in my business, I did. I did it the first month. I had over fifteen thousand dollars. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

Wow. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And here I am trying to do all this stuff that people were saying is so amazing. And I already done it, I had no idea.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

I love that I had something similar is that I wasn't actually going for a specific dollar amount or a monthly amount. I was going for how many people can I help. Because I want to help as many people as I can. And yeah, then all of a sudden, I started having those double digit months. And it was like, oh, oh, this is pretty cool. But we start off in service first, because that's what comes naturally to us. Because you and I both love to just help people.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yes, yes. And when you try to make it more about money, with my human designing the way I'm wired, it's a bad bad idea. It just doesn't work for me. But it also I just want to point out too, that the reason why you can't see things clearly is because it is a major trauma response. When all these emotions come up and people complain and things happen. It's almost like you want to just panic and you want to run for the cave. Like Oh my God, what did I get myself. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So I tucked away for two years. For two years I didn't try to sell anything. I coached people online and in groups. I created a following of people who were like-minded and had similar values to mine. I did some free coaching. I did major, major deep dive in human design and the Gene Keys and Eckhart Tolle and Universal Law. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Like I literally just really went all in. And it wasn't until just a couple weeks ago, a few weeks ago, that I actually started to try to sell again. And it feels quite different this time than it did the first time. Yes, I have a system that can support all of it now. And all the tools that I need to get back into that space when I get activated or triggered.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

This and this is a perfect time, I have questions for you about how do you start to calm your nervous system. So someone that's just now starting to realize that their nervous system is dysregulated. And it's making it really hard to be an entrepreneur? What are some of those first things that people can do?

 

SO, HOW DO WE EVEN CALM DOWN?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Okay, so we talked about this a lot in the coaching industry. I don't know if other people are aware of it, but I call them Brain Drains. Right? So you get everything that you're thinking about, anything where you can find something specific, and you put it on paper in front of you. So it gives you a little idea of what's going on in your mind. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then I learned this differently, but I do it differently myself because I felt like it's more valuable. Because it's more focused on your feelings instead of your thoughts. So you go through the whole list then, and every thought that you have you identify what you're feeling, what emotion, one word next to each one. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Okay, pick the top three. And I call that your primary state of mind. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

Okay.

 

Maureen Kafkis

Okay, so you look at your primary state of mind. And then you look at, What is that creating for you in your business? Who are you avoiding because of that? What are you avoiding? What are you doing instead? 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So you really do a full assessment of what, how that emotion or those feelings are impacting you in business, because you need to cultivate awareness first, before you can change something or reprogram it. But then the next part of that is I have this thing called the FEAR Factor. I call it FEAR Factor, and that encompasses any uncomfortable emotion. Right? 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Because usually uncomfortable emotion scares us. We don't like it. We think there's a problem. Right? I call it FEAR Factor, and it's similar to the model where it's C-T-F-A-R. This is fear, F-E-A-R. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So F is feeling, and that's the one emotion, and I usually ask people to take one of the emotions from their primary state of mind, put that in there. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then E is to do an evaluation of what that emotion feels like in their body. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

Okay. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Okay. Everybody has different ways of describing that. Some people use a texture, some people use a color. Some people, it's just a feeling, does it move, you know, whatever. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then A is the assessment. And that's like, how is this really impacting everything that you're doing? What is the assessment that you have of this emotion, being in your life and how it's keeping you from achieving the goals that you want. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then R is reframing emotion and finding the gift in it. Because there's always always a gift with an uncomfortable emotion. And for me, when I decided to do the deep dive and move away, I was trying to figure out what had gone wrong. I was trying to figure out all the ways to do things, and I had this major anxiety, and I felt terrible. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And just one day, my intuition said, you just need to stop and start over, you need to stop. And we need to get out of here. And you need to get yourself in a position where you're able to handle this. So my anxiety, that I thought was over marketing, I’m praying for the answers to marketing. The universe knew that it was better for me not to have marketing strategies. Because I do not have a solid belief foundation in myself.  

 

Maureen Kafkis

And the universe told me that you need to work on yourself, and believing in yourself and your nervous system, then come on back, and we'll get you taken care of when you try to achieve your goals.

 

BUT…I’M THE BREADWINNER OF MY FAMILY

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah. Yeah, I could imagine that being something that could stop someone in their tracks. Right? Because everybody has a different financial background. Like, for me, I was the breadwinner of my family. And so we had a family of seven, and I was the primary breadwinner. At times, I wouldn't be able to step back. I had to keep going. So that I could make money to take care of my family. But also, carve that space, because if I didn't take care of my trauma response, it was going to make things a lot harder. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

But also physically, it was hurting me. Chest hurting, my arms were hurting. I had had a mini-stroke in the past. So I was worried about that. It could go straight to my gut, like IBS would kick in, it was just awful. I had to try to figure out a balance of, How can I do business and go forward and make money but also, how can I help myself? 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

What would you recommend to people that are in that predicament?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Okay, so I love that you brought this up. Because we're all designed differently. We're all here in a different role. It’s all part of the same curriculum. We're all, all our curriculums are intertwined. But we all have a different role. And I am doing what we're supposed to be doing here. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

So the universe blessed me with a situation where I don't need money. Okay, because I'm supposed to be doing what I'm doing right now. Helping other people who do need money. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

Yes. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Right? So it's really about knowing, What is your role? Because in your situation, it's not the same as mine. So you're not doing what I'm doing. You're a business coach, and you're helping people to make money that way, and you're bringing emotional and mental health into the mix, because that's your role to bring that to your clients and business. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

So, for me, a big part of it was understanding my human design. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

Okay

 

Maureen Kafkis 

Understanding my energy type, my strategy in life. For me, I'm a projector. So people don't want to hear what I have to say, unless they invite me to share, they literally won't hear it. And I can be super repelling people because of my aura. If they don't want me to know things about them.

 

Maureen Kafkis

I’ve experienced this my whole life. But I also would give people advice all the time. On a regular basis, my entire life. It was so bad when they wouldn’t listen, because I’d be like, I know what I'm talking about. Why aren't they listening to me? 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

Yeah. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So yeah, so I would say, understanding your human design for me and my Gene Keys was really helpful, because it kind of showed me my life purpose in my work. And I think that's helpful, and helping you figure out how to find the balance.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Can you tell me what Gene Keys are?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yeah, Gene Keys is sort of like Richard Rudd's take on human design. He's kind of put his own spin on it. And he has this amazing program, the Golden Path program. He also has a book, The Gene Keys, but he also has an amazing program with an activation sequence, which is about your life work. A Venus sequence, which is all about your relationships, and how you show up in them. And the Pearl sequence is how you make money.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

The more you get to know yourself, and you know, all of these things are just different languages, for you to listen to your intuition and go inward. But you have to find the ones that resonate with you. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

So I would say that for somebody who has to make money and can't stop doing it like I did, don't stop. But also set aside time to learn about yourself. Don't set aside time to work with‚Äď‚Äď I know, I'm saying this to a business coach. But my advice is until you have a solid belief foundation in yourself, and there's ways to do that without spending a lot of money. And then you can trust yourself with who you hire, to coach.¬†

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Right? So do a deep dive on your personal life. If you're not successful, business-wise, that is not your problem. It is a problem. What do you call that? It's like cause and effect, right? That's the effect of taking care of some inner work, because the personal and the business are totally related.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

I completely agree. That's why I like to include both when I work with my clients. And sometimes they come in thinking, Okay, we're gonna work all on business. But all of the obstacles getting in the way of them actually being able to do the business stuff. It's all personal stuff. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

And so sometimes it can be kind of frustrating that it's like, we're going to spend all this time and it's just going to be all their personal stuff. And they're like, Well, but wait a minute, I need to make progress in my business, it's like, you're not going to be able to make progress in your business unless you take care of these things. Because you're getting so triggered by everything, that something (I'm going to say as simple, although we know there's all sorts of stuff that goes into this), as simple as making a social media post. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

There can be people that are so triggered by that, that a social media post can take them a month to create. And it's because they have so much of the stuff that they haven't worked through yet. But once they actually work through it, they're going to be able to make social media posts within like five, ten minutes. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

And it's just going to be like, Okay, super, super easy to start to market their business and talk with their people. But if they decide, I just need to focus on business, I'm just going to shove all this down, I'm going to do the ‚ÄėNikes, Just Do It‚Äô, and push through and do it.¬†

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

They're going to go so incredibly slow in their business, and they're going to feel awful, and they're not going to enjoy it. And they're eventually going to want to stop altogether. So. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yeah, yeah. Okay, so you bring up another good point. This one, I kind of get a little offended for other coaches for when I see so-called business coaches, and you are an actual business coach. And I know that and that's why I work with you. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

Many coaches out there claiming to be business coaches that are not, they don't address the emotional or mental aspect. Not really, they might dive into the thought work a little bit, but they don't go into the nervous system and stuff and that they want their clients to go out there and do things so they make the money that that business coach guaranteed them they're gonna make. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

Yeah. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then when they don't do it, the business coach gets pissed, blames it on the new coach or entrepreneur that's doing the very best they can. But they have unacknowledged trauma, their nervous system dysregulated. They're not, not doing it because they're lazy, or they're not listening or they're not following commands. They're literally a basket case on the verge of a nervous breakdown. 

 

IS IT ME OR IS IT YOU?

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

But I can attest to that. Because I've been there, I have been that basket case on the verge of a nervous breakdown, especially at the first year of my business. And I'll actually share, one of the things that was causing a trauma response was when I was in corporate, we had an internal social media. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

So we were using Google Plus back then. And I think Google Plus doesn't even exist anymore. But they were trying to be like a Facebook feed. And so as business coaches, in corporate, we're trying to present all of the positive examples of people doing the behaviors that we're trying to teach. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

And I would start posting saying, Hey, here's an excellent example; this team is implementing this tool, this is how they did it. This is where they started off what their pains were, then they tried this. And they found that it worked for them. And this is the benefit. And you know, congratulations, great job for giving this a try. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

And I actually had another coach in my group, there were only like six of us plus our boss, and he was telling me that I was posting too much and like grandstanding and trying to get attention. And I had posted maybe three times in one week. That stuck with me, and none of the other coaches were posting very frequently, it might be maybe once a week, if that maybe every other week, maybe once a month, even. And some that didn't post it all. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

But then as you get out and you're an entrepreneur, and you need to be able to mark it. If you have something like that hanging over you that oh, well, you're grandstanding, you're just trying to get attention. And it's so hard to get out there and actually do it because you're like, oh my gosh, all these people are gonna think these bad things about me. But businesses need to market their business so that they can attract their clients. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

And so what do you do? You have to face and work through that trauma.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Right? And that guy was trying to make you diminish yourself to make him feel better about himself.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah, I realized that he was presenting his self-limiting belief, and saying that this was the truth. At the time, I wasn't recognizing it as his own self-limiting belief. I was just accepting it as truth, and holding myself to blame, according to that. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

But then after going through processing all of the trauma, it's realizing, Oh, I was doing things that were outside of their comfort zone. I was doing what I was supposed to be doing. But it was outside their comfort zone. So they were trying to make me stop. So they didn't have to do it.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yeah, and because you were dysregulated, you thought that what he was saying was factual. Who had done something wrong. It was. So the other thing too, we didn't, I didn't mention this before, when we were talking about FEAR Factor. 

 

FIND AN EMOTIONAL RELEASE!

 

Maureen Kafkis  

You recognize it, you get the message from it. And after you get the message, you can let it go. So in order to let it go, you have to feel the feeling. And you have to release it. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

Yes. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Which there's kind of different ways you could do it. But one of my favorites that I'll just share here is I record The Voice on TV and have it there all the time, the blind auditions. And when I want to cry and I want to release my emotions, I workout in the exercise room. And I turned on The Voice. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

Oh. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

I see people getting up there and going big, really big. People who have never been on a stage before. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

Yeah.

 

Maureen Kafkis

Singing their hearts out, out there. And trying to get this audition and the families are all up there crying. And I'm literally bawling the whole time. I love that show. It really inspires me. I started crying because I'm so happy for them. And I start crying, I don't know why. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And the idea is you find some way to get those emotions to come up, meditation, nature, wherever it is. And you let it come up. And then you distance yourself from why you started crying in the first place. Just let it fly. Like you just laid it all out. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And sometimes I'll be like sobbing. like My head hurts after being so happy a minute ago. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

Yeah.

 

Maureen Kafkis

Watching the show. It's really interesting. But you had to just keep doing that over and over and over again. And you'll know you're doing it correctly, because you'll feel lighter after the cry. You won't feel worse.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Oh my gosh, this is such a great example. Thank you. Yes, I know exactly what you're talking about for me. Sometimes. Yeah, it's hard for me to cry. Even when I first started college, I noticed that I wasn't much of a crier, but I was also diagnosed with depression at age 19. So it's like well, how is it that I could have depression, but I couldn't cry. Well, because somewhere along the line, I was told not to cry. Like, you have to suppress the crying. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

And I joined a sorority in college. And I was noticing, that at a lot of these different ceremonies, we get together, that the other girls were all crying. And I couldn't bring myself to cry. And I was like, What is wrong with me? 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

But yeah, so it's sometimes, it's a skill, that you have to practice to learn how to allow the emotions to flow out of you because they're trapped. There's this book, I haven't read it, but I hear a lot of people love it. And you might know it, The Body Keeps Score.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Oh, no, but that sounds interesting.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah, so I really want to read this book, one of my other colleagues in coaching, she's a trauma specialist. And she swears by this book, that basically, if you're not allowing your emotions to come out, and to flow and to process out of your body, it's getting trapped in your body, your body's keeping the score of all of that. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

And so then when you're going out, you're trying to do things, of course, you're gonna have that trauma response, because it never got out of your body. And so I love that you had this way of finding a way that could get the tears flowing, so that you could let all of your suppressed tears flow out, even if you can't remember where it came from. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

And for me, it's tears, sometimes are it, but also anger. Because I was also taught a long time ago not to express my anger, being given permission to go somewhere where it's safe, where no one's gonna judge you for expressing anger. And just letting anger flow. It's amazing. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

And I've been super interested in going to these, I don't know what they call them. But there's rooms where they've already set it up to look like a dining room or something else, where maybe there's plates and glasses and stuff. And they give you safety glasses and a sledgehammer to just go in and destroy everything in sight, and get all of that anger out of you. And I think that's why some people will go to the gym and use like punching bags, or just run really hard on the treadmill to process some of those feelings out.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yeah, you bring up a couple of things. One, I can cry at the drop of a dime. So I'm always crying. But I also can be feeling really happy because I've been doing this work so deeply for now. Those are the times where I want to go purposely find a reason to cry to get going right? You could use it either way. Sometimes, if you just lay down, you get still, the tears will come. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And as far as anger, like I have come to believe that anger is a very, very dear friend of mine. And she shows up when it's time for me to take it to the next level. When I have to get bigger, get like angry on behalf of other people. I will do or say anything that I need to say to get my message across in a way that if it was just about me. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

I don't know if I would because it's part of my human design and my crisis service. So it's when anger shows up now. I'm like, Okay, wait, what's gonna happen? What are we doing? The next step? Why am I getting mad? How am I? 

 

Maureen Kafkis

No, I'm not saying that that happens when like, I get pissed off at my husband. Kind of reactive anger, right, right there on talking about is responsive anger. Our wise adult self, it's like a whole We're going to tap into anger and we're gonna say some things and we're gonna get some conversations going and make some things happen. And also, I walk a lot and I play pickleball. So I'm pretty active physically. Typically, the best outlet for me for anger is speaking my truth.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

And that's what, I love that you have a podcast. Because I did that too, is I felt that I didn't always get a voice to speak but anyone can start a podcast. And it gives us that outlet where we can speak. And the amazing thing and I know you've seen it too is that people start to listen. And and we see it because we can see our download numbers and you've had some incredible success with your podcast and getting lots of downloads so people are listening to you.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yeah, because I'm listening to me. And I'm saying what I need to say and I believe that wholeheartedly, like my energy is totally behind it. And the other thing that I do with the podcast because I do a lot of interviews now is really creating meaningful relationships. Not people to pitch, you know, my sales to or any of that stuff. But I can have meaningful, deep conversations with people all the time. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

It's like a dream come true for me, because let me tell you, like all my pickleball friends do not want to have deep meaningful conversations with me. And my family members have to find a great outlet for really getting to feel really connected to other people. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then the other part is, it almost doesn't even matter if anybody's listening, because the person who gets to come on and speak their truth for the very first time, literally, you can see a difference in them by the end of the podcast. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

All of this, in my opinion, all this work is about personal power, speaking your truth and showing up as your authentic self, and not caring how it's received by anyone else, because you think you're so amazing that you're authentic.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

And you're being brave enough to say things that other people were not ready to say yet. And then they're just so relieved that there's someone else finally starting that conversation, and that it's safe for them to go and talk with that person. Because you've already put it out there. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

That's like true advocate energy there is you're saying it's helping you. It's definitely like, right there. It's important to you. But as you said, your cross of service, you're speaking up also for all of them, and they're super grateful for it.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yeah. And every time I go to post, or do anything related to my business, or my personal life, I check in with my body first. And my splenic authority is, when it's a no. And my intuition tells me when it's a yes. And when those two cooperate, I know for sure I'm on the right track. I check in, because sometimes they say controversial things. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

I brought up the one hundred-K goal. I had a podcast episode on that. I talked about the lack of transparency and in consults, with coaching. I talked about people being too focused on money over service. And now I'm educating people on how to find a coach so they can’t be manipulated. And their money objections cannot be overcome, because they are solid in their budget. And they're not going to be deterred by somebody who knows how to talk them, and you're doing something different. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So I have to really think about it before I put it out there because I have to make sure because I can also get a little carried away with like, like, Oh, this is fine, let's create another reaction. They're very powerful and responsive. I'm just telling you that it comes from being nine out of ten to be really responsive and thoughtful about what I put out there, what I do. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then if I make a wrong turn, or I do something wrong, I'm just accountable. And I, I fix it. And if I receive an invitation from someone, and it doesn't work for me, then I politely explain to them why I'm leaving the group or I can't, this isn't a good fit for me. And I always, always, always listen to my intuition now. Am I spinning? Because too many bad things have happened when I haven't. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And everything, i I do that, and I stay aligned in what I'm doing every single day, something shows up that I need to get me to the next step. And that's the difference between before when I started to feel successful and when I got panicky, it's because I was looking into the future and fearful of what would be expected of me. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Now I stay focused on being committed to the next action you take. That's it. Anytime I tried to go out, I go back to that just stay one action at a time and just stay in this place. And we're going to be fine.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Ah, that is some fantastic grounding. I could see where that would definitely ground.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

It really grounds me. It does.

 

I’M A STRUGGLING COACH--CAN I MASTER THE BRAIN BS??

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

So you've created a course to help people.Can you tell me about it?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yes, I would love to tell you about it. So it's called Mastering Brain BS For The Struggling Coach. And even though you kind of didn't like the name at first, you said it’s grown on you.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

I love it now. 

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Well, because they're struggling. Right? So like sometimes when we're talking about universal law and law of attraction and stuff, they guide how we have to be specific and it has to be. But if you're coming from a place inside you that has that energy, then I think that that's going to trump anything that you name it, too, right? 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So the energy is to I saw all these posts on social media, of these coaches, mostly entrepreneurs, really struggling and beating themselves up and I know I did it too. And it felt awful to care so much about people and to be in service and when I help people so badly. And to feel like you're a complete failure at it, and not have any idea of how to make it happen. 

Maureen Kafkis

And a large part of that was because of that seed was planted for us to make a hundred thousand dollars the first year. And I know that did not happen for me, and it doesn't for the majority of people. But it almost sets us up for failure, from the get go for those of us who have no background in any of this, and I've never done anything like this before. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So it was super discouraging. And I actually like I would read people’s posts, and it brought me pain. Like I was just like, oh, my gosh, this is ridiculous. And it kind of activated the advocate and activist in me. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

It's funny, because when I heard people talking about courses, like years ago, I was like, Well, I'm definitely not doing a course I'm done with school. There's a small part of me that always knew I was gonna do a course. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

I created this course, because when I realized that you could do business however you want. It can be fun. It does not have to stretch you to the point of a nervous breakdown or fill in terrible. And you could do it your way. And I was just like, oh my gosh, this is so much more fun. There has to be a bunch of coaches out there that can benefit from this. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And this isn't just for coaches who aren't making money. This is for coaches who are basket cases because they are making money and they might not keep the money, or they're gonna go away.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah. Because that happens too. Yeah, absolutely.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

So it's not, I'm not a business coach. I'm like an emotional well-being coach, I'm a build-solid-belief-foundation in yourself, get-your-nervous-system-going kinda coach. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then you go out and you hire your business coach or whoever else you want. But you do it, like smart. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez

Yeah.

 

Maureen Kafkis

You don't spend a boatload of money on coaches without even really telling them what you want from them.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Yeah. That's so important. Because, yeah, sometimes they're buying into a program that is too advanced. And they need to start with a different program that meets them where they're at, develops those skill sets before they go on to the next thing. But yeah, if they get caught up, some people are just fantastic sales people there. They're great at their marketing, but it might not be the right thing for the person.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Well, exactly. And often, it's not when you're a new coach, and you don't have the nervous system for it. It's like the worst thing. And it causes a lot of people to give up and quit. Because they don't think they have what it takes. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

It's crazy how we think we can be totally confident in one area of our life, and then we go to do something new, and we forget that we can bring that with us. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

That's right.

 

Maureen Kafkis 

We're starting in this new situation, and you need to know all this stuff. But now I know that that's not true anymore. I know that no matter where I am, I can have a solid belief foundation myself, no matter what new venture I try. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

So I created this course, right. And then I also created a community to go with it. Didn't know I was going to do that even a couple of months before I decided to do it. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And the Collaborative Coaching Capital Community, and I created it for anyone who purchases the course for a hundred dollars. They get access into this community where you collaborate and you support one another in a way that I've never really seen in any other groups. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

Because we also are going to give ten percent of the proceeds from the course, to a coach and that group who is actively participating and collaborating and supporting other people. And then they can decide what they're going to do that's going to inspire all of us. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

They could do something with our own community, or they can pay it forward to somebody else who needs the money. It can even be an individual who just desperately needs the money. But however they do it, the person comes back and they share with all of us how they did it. And then we talk about all the different things like we're just getting started, right? 

 

Maureen Kafkis
So I'm trying to get creative about What can we do? Like what are all the things that we can do to get people thinking differently about coaching, making it more accessible to more people. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then I'm also taking all those people in that group and putting them on my website in a directory where people will see a bio picture of them. There are links, and they'll have my support and looking for clients in the community support. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

So it's really it feels like a grassroots movement. It really does feel like a movement. It does. I felt like it, my Gene Keys designed this is exactly what I'm supposed to be doing. So I don't even feel, I sometimes say my community because I started it, but it's really not. And living consciously is not my coaching. Right? I'm just channeling all this. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

It goes way back to the beginning of time. All the things in my course, but I take what I've learned the last few years from all these books, and all these experts in all these different places, I guess you could say, I’m like a jack-of-all-trades and master-of-none except with my business. Because I know how to live my human design. But I couldn't tell you half of it. I know my Gene Keys, but if you told me like, right now, if I had to tell you what my life purpose is, I couldn't say it the way he does. Because I just learned what I need, a nd then I apply it.

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then in this course, I integrate all of it in a manageable way, that makes sense. And the feedback I've gotten is, it's easy. It's simple, the modules are ten minutes. There's a call to action, you could do just that, and have a huge difference in the way you're feeling. But there's also a deep dive workbook to go much deeper, which is what I would recommend. But everybody is different, and I just wanted to appeal to both kinds of learners. The people who want to go really deep, and the ones who don't.

 

Maureen Kafkis

And then down the line, I'm going to be creating more things around that course, for coaches, I'm a projector so I have to have time to rest and play. I have time to do other things. And I have to take breaks from this. Because I get kind of caught up in wanting to see the results. Get a little impatient. And that's how I know when it's time to go play pickleball or go paddleboarding, or go on a little trip.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

I love that. I love that. So the name of your course, tell us again.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Mastering Brain BS for the Struggling Coach.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Nice. And so after they've taken the course, how are they gonna feel in their body?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Oh my god, they're gonna feel amazing. They're gonna trust themselves, to make all the decisions. They're gonna be making decisions from an educated, aware place. Instead of unacknowledged trauma, that is causing them to desperately reach out and pay all these people money, which is exactly what I did. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

They're gonna realize that, oh, wait, that whole thing that we were sold that business has to look this way. You have to do your consults, you have to do, you know, overcome objections. You have to. It’s total BS, you can do it however you want. And that's how I'm doing it. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

I don't even do consults. I meet with people, I connect with them, I bring them on the podcast and make friends with them. I play pickleball with them. They have like minded values, and they believe in what I'm doing. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And this is just the beginning because there's a thing called bridging the gap. If you didn't want it in the coaching communities, I'm bridging the gap in a different way. I am hooking up coaches with the appropriate clients, where their budgets are in sync all the different levels. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And I'm making coaching more accessible to people and educating them on how to hire a coach so that they can feel better. And then the coach can feel better when they get this client because they're better match.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Great match. Yeah, that's fantastic. That's fantastic. So how can people get in touch with you and be able to purchase this course?

 

CONNECTING WITH MAUREEN

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Well, I have a website: thebrainbs.com. And there is a page on there thebrainbs.com/forthecoaches. So click on that. And then you can read about the course. And then you could just click on that baby, and pay a hundred dollars, and access the course immediately. 

 

During the course, at the beginning at the top of the course then there is a link to the Facebook community. So I won't share that right here. But the podcast, so if we could put a link for the podcasts in your show notes.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

And tell them the name of your podcast.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

The Brain BS podcast. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Very nice. Very nice. All right. And can they follow you on social media?

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Yes, I have a Facebook account. That is a personal one that I made into a professional. Right? Isn't that what we did? That's what we did. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez 

Yeah.

 

Maureen Kafkis

I'm not your typical coach, like with the learning and the technology and stuff. Gretchen helps me with some of that stuff. But I do have a Facebook account. 

 

Maureen Kafkis

And we have a podcast community, The Brain BS Podcast Community. Yeah, that's there for now. I'm not, I'm mainstreaming, I got rid of some different groups that I had. So I'm bringing it all together. And I'm going to totally simplify so I can go really big. 

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

That sounds fantastic. And I'm going to put all of your links into the show notes for this episode so that people can get to you very easily and I highly encourage everybody to come and talk with Maureen. She's amazing. She's going to be able to help you in ways that you never even knew that you needed help because she knows a lot more things than some of our regular business coaches. And so yes, highly, highly recommend Marine,

 

Maureen Kafkis  

I really believe that this course is a foundation that every human, whether it's in coach format, or the non coach that every single person should do, it's like, gives you the opportunity to live your life to the absolute highest potential. And to make decisions in a way that really benefits you. 

 

Maureen Kafkis 

So whether you're a coach that works with chemical dependency, people, or you're just a therapist, or whatever, whether it's businesses, or I really can't think of an organization that could not benefit from using this course, to help whoever it is that they're serving, to set them up for success, and make it better. It's like a win-win-win for everybody all around. Alright, that's all, I’ll stop talking.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

Maureen, thank you so much for coming on today. And thank you for creating this course. I think we all need it.

 

Maureen Kafkis  

Thank you for having me. And thank you for helping me with it.

 

Gretchen Hernandez  

You're absolutely welcome. 

 

All right, my strong friends, I hope that you discovered a whole bunch of wonderful nuggets. Throughout that interview, it's important for you to be able to take care of your mind as well as your body. So calming down your nervous system is gonna help you to make a lot of progress in your business, and have a lot higher quality of life. 



Looking back at how many things you learned just from this interview, I bet you can imagine how many more things you're going to learn by taking Maureen's course. 

 

When you're ready to jump in, head over to her website to purchase this course. The website address is thebrainbs.com/forthecoaches. And that link will also be in the show notes so that you can jump on over there, grab that course and start to calm down your nervous system. 

 

Alright, my friends. I hope you have a great week and I'll talk with you soon. Bye. Bye.

 

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Thank you for listening to My Freedom Grove Podcast. When you are ready to make your dream business a reality and take care of your mental health, I invite you to join the Unshakable Business Co-Lab. This is the mastermind membership you've been waiting for. There's no limits on your imagination, nor your timeline. We're with you every step of the way. To learn more, please visit www.myfreedomgrove.com/join. I'll see you there!

 

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